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Post by Bannanachair on Dec 17, 2017 22:30:09 GMT -4
So I was thinking about how different forms of love and marriage which used to be tabboo are now becoming accepted more and more, and then I started thinking about what the future of that might be. So, for instance: - Interracial marriage used to be illegal in a lot of states, but in the 1960s it was legalized on a federal level. About 13% of all Americans still think that it should be illegal, according to this gallup poll. That same source also says that only 4% of people roughly our age are against it, so I'm going to go ahead and say that we're all in favour of allowing people to love who they want no matter the colour of their skin.
- Gay marriage is also a thing that is becoming legal and acceptable in society. According to this gallup poll it's still a bit of a divisive issue, but the trend is clearly indicating that more and more people are becoming cool with it, and that's a good thing. Australia only just legalized gay marriage, which means that, for the first time in quite a while, America can claim to have been more progressive than another first-world country on a social issue.
- Likewise, I think that sex before marriage, and living with your partner before marriage, is more acceptable now than it was at some vague point in the past before the sexual revolution, but I don't know what to search to find the information on that, so I'm going to say that that's just a hunch.
Now, that's taken care of the ones that are already becoming accepted, but that got me wondering what's to come in the future, both in terms of legal acceptability and in terms of social acceptability. (personally, I think that marriage, like friendship and being in the same D&D party, should become a solely societal thing with no basis in the legal system, no tax benefits, etc., while laws will be implemented allowing people to choose who will get hospital visitation rights and whatnot, but the delegalization of marriage is something that I think isn't going to happen at all, so I'm not including it). - One thing that I think will happen immediately is that the age of consent will drop to fifteen or even fourteen, like in lots of Europe. I don't want a thirty year old to have sex with a fourteen year old, but at the same time, if a sixteen-year-old guy has sex with his fifteen-year-old girlfriend who's just a couple months younger I do not think that that guy should go to jail for statutory rape. I do not think that it is possible to prevent teenagers from having sex, as such, the thing to do to ensure that nothing bad happens is to destigmatize it and to allow for an open and honest dialogue about it, and to make contraceptives available to basically everyone after puberty.
- I think that first cousin marriage will make a comeback. I read somewhere that it is somewhat making a comeback, and I don't think that it was ever made illegal (just that it stopped being fashionable), so that's probably going to happen. It doesn't really make birth defects much more likely, but even then the goal of every relationship isn't to have kids, and not even every sexual encounter exists to create kids (hence why contraceptives exist). Really the biggest downside to this is that it makes family reunions extremely awkward.
- Apparently Woody Allen is still allowed by studios to make movies despite the fact that he married his fucking daughter, so that's something. I don't think that it'll become acceptable for normal people to marry their children, but it's worth mentioning here.
- Committed polygamous relationships, I think, will become more acceptable, maybe shortly after or at around the same time as cousin marriage makes a comeback. By committed polygamous relationships, I don't mean a string of one-night stands where one person sees a bunch of other people in quick succession, nor do I mean adultery. Rather, I mean that three or more people will all come together and agree that that group of people will be in a romantic/sexual relationship with eachother, but not with people outside of that group. So someone could, for instance, have two girlfriends completely aware of the other's existence, or have both a husband and a wife, or something like that. I hope that this becomes a thing because I hate love triangles in fiction and this seems like an easy solution to all of them so that I don't have to deal with that crap anymore.
- As medical technology gets better and people both live longer and remain young for longer, I think that age will become less of a factor in people's relationships. If, at a hundred years old, you had the body of a twenty-five year old and could be expected to live for at least a few hundred more years, I doubt that you'd care that the person that you're dating is only forty. I'm obviously exaggerating a bit, as it's unlikely to be like this for a while, but fans of the fantasy genre have to be fine with this if aging can be slowed down, given the prevalence of half-elves in fantasy.
- Marriage will become largely obsolete, I think. Honestly it's been an outdated system ever since I became unable to send my teenage daughter off to some foreign lord older than I am to secure an alliance with a foreign state, but that's just my two cents. There's some data to show that people are getting married a lot less, so if that continues for much longer, I think that our grandkids will be the last generation to get married.
- As medical technology and gene therapy and whatnot become more advanced and affordable, there will no longer be a biological reason that siblings can't procreate, so I think that, at some point a hundred and fifty years in the future, sibling incest might become acceptable (maybe a lot shorter, depending on the long-term cultural impact of Game of Thrones). This one weirds me out in a way that none of the others do (aside from the Woody Allen thing), but I want to explore all possibilities, so I'm including it nonetheless, and I can't provide any good arguments against it other than that I personally find it gross, but lots of homophobic people think that gay people are gross, so I don't think it's my place to provide any judgement on what other people do.
So, what do you guys think the future of love and marriage will be? What are your thoughts on the possibilities that I mentioned above - both whether you think they'll happen and whether you want them to be allowed to happen?
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Post by Bannanachair on Dec 17, 2017 22:39:25 GMT -4
By the way, I'm not advocating entering a polygamous incestuous relationship with your sibling who's fifty years older than you when you're fourteen, I just think that all of those different movements for marriage legalization/acceptance will occur at some point in the future. I personally disagree with the morality of a decent number of the things that I said that people in the future might not have an issue with, but I'm curious as to people's opinions on it.
Also, please keep any arguing here civilized. Don't be an ass to people because of their views on this topic.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 18, 2017 0:06:39 GMT -4
I would just like to start this off by saying you're a stupid dummyhead and your opinions suck. Now I may begin. Likewise, I think that sex before marriage, and living with your partner before marriage, is more acceptable now than it was at some vague point in the past before the sexual revolution, but I don't know what to search to find the information on that, so I'm going to say that that's just a hunch. Yeah, I'm not quite sure on the specifics of that, either. I am reading a history book right now that details on some of that, though, so if I find out anything, I'll probably post it here. (That said, this thread will probably be dead by then.) °Strongly Disagree °Disagree °Agree •Strongly Agree (if anyone can't tell, the 4th option is filled in)● Strongly Agree(Specifically the last part.) I don't think that was ever acceptable...? That needs to happen. I think marriage is getting outdated, but I don't think securing alliances was the main thing that's gone/going away to make it obsolete. I think the main reasons to get married were usually drenched in mysogynistic ideas (specifically, the ancient belief that women were weaker, more stupid, and more sinful than men, and that men had to guard and control them because of this belief) and that they've gotten outdated as more and more people realize that these repeated ancient beliefs are full of shit. That said, it takes a long time for society as a whole to realize that shitty ideas are, in fact, really stupid, especially if they've been around for centuries, so we'll see how that goes. I'm hoping that marriage can just be done away with, but I don't think it'll happen that soon. Then again, three generations is a lot longer than it sounds, so who knows. With all of that said, there's a good chance you were at least sort of kidding about that, and I was supposed to be asleep by now, so I'm not sure how organized or well I said my ideas. I can probably elaborate on some of the stuff there if you want me to, probably tomorrow. |
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Post by Bannanachair on Dec 18, 2017 0:27:45 GMT -4
I would just like to start this off by saying you're a stupid dummyhead and your opinions suck. Yeah, well... Uhh... You too! Likewise, I think that sex before marriage, and living with your partner before marriage, is more acceptable now than it was at some vague point in the past before the sexual revolution, but I don't know what to search to find the information on that, so I'm going to say that that's just a hunch. Yeah, I'm not quite sure on the specifics of that, either. I am reading a history book right now that details on some of that, though, so if I find out anything, I'll probably post it here. (That said, this thread will probably be dead by then.) Feel free to necrobump this, then. °Strongly Disagree °Disagree °Agree •Strongly Agree (if anyone can't tell, the 4th option is filled in)Another benefit to this is that it gets rid of bad divorce settlements. My grandfather lost what would be over a million dollars in today's money to my grandmother ($125,000 at the time, though), who then purchased a house and sold it for half of the price that it was purchased for, from what he told me. ● Strongly Agree(Specifically the last part.) For the record, I'm advocating access to contraception for teens who are going to be doing sex. I am not advocating that teens do sex. Teens should not do sex, but if they do sex (which they shouldn't) they should do sex safely. And by "teens" I mean early teenagers, not like 19 year olds and whatnot, 19 year olds can do whatever the hell they want to. I don't think that was ever acceptable...? Can you please kindly explain that to Woody Allen? I mean, I can actually think of one book where that does happen (The Wheel of Time has Rand taking on three different wives by the end), and there's probably fanfiction of most series/books where that's how that was resolved (though I don't recommend going too far down that rabbit-hole because fanfiction gets weird fast). I think marriage is getting outdated, but I don't think securing alliances was the main thing that's gone/going away to make it obsolete. I think the main reasons to get married were usually drenched in mysogynistic ideas (specifically, the ancient belief that women were weaker, more stupid, and more sinful than men, and that men had to guard and control them because of this belief) and that they've gotten outdated as more and more people realize that these repeated ancient beliefs are full of shit. That said, it takes a long time for society as a whole to realize that shitty ideas are, in fact, really stupid, especially if they've been around for centuries, so we'll see how that goes. I'm hoping that marriage can just be done away with, but I don't think it'll happen that soon. Then again, three generations is a lot longer than it sounds, so who knows. In the middle ages, at least, marriage served an important geopolitical purpose, but yeah, over the past few centuries it's mostly become the misogynistic bullshit that you said. When I said three generations, I meant that that's going to be the last vestiges of marriage in any sizable demographic of the population: I think that fewer than two thirds of people our age of our generation are going to get married, and that of the generation that would be our kids it'd be more like one third, at least in the secular west. With all of that said, there's a good chance you were at least sort of kidding about that, and I was supposed to be asleep by now, so I'm not sure how organized or well I said my ideas. I can probably elaborate on some of the stuff there if you want me to, probably tomorrow. I presented my argument in a slightly humorous way, but I wasn't kidding. Fuck marriage. It used to serve a geopolitical purpose that actually made sense and provided military and economic alliances to entire nations, but it's been obsolete since we've stopped using feudalism as our form of government. |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 18, 2017 7:23:18 GMT -4
Yeah, I'm not quite sure on the specifics of that, either. I am reading a history book right now that details on some of that, though, so if I find out anything, I'll probably post it here. (That said, this thread will probably be dead by then.) Feel free to necrobump this, then. I will be sure to do that. Yeah, that's more along what I was agreeing with; I don't think young teens should be having sex either, but it would be great if sex education wasn't the crap it is currently. ("Abstinence is how to not get STDs!" "Don't ever, ever talk about sex, not even in health class!") The mysogynistic bullshit came from before the middle ages. It was really big in ancient Greece, and still big (but slightly less big) in the Roman Empire. Middle Ages come and almost everybody's too poor to bother being that mysogynistic, but in the Church and then later in the Renaissance, where the scholars were, it was made popular (and enforced) again by the people who read old philosophers' works. And uh, marrying for political reasons was mostly for upper classes. Common people on the higher end were married off for the sake of being married off- making heirs, giving the husband's family lots of money through dowries that kept getting bigger and bigger, etc- and poorer people got to the point where they couldn't afford to marry because they couldn't pay the dowry. That wasn't the case everywhere, though, especially in Medieval Europe, because the darn thing about those ages is that they're incredibly inconsistent. Still, I think it's safe to say that lower-class people never married for political reasons, or if they did, it was smaller estates; not entire countries. |
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